LED light vs HPS light yield / watt

[MedicalOnly]

Because you now looking at it like a mathematician. 1000ppfd at the corners and how much in the middle? Then how high do you hang it? Remember the high the more light wasted to light bleed missing the plants. It's no better than the 600w ones that can be kept closer. All that extra wattage is going towards wasted light not being used by the plants because you need to hang it high so you don't cook em. Try a gavita 1700e and see if you can put it 6" away because that essentially what you would be doing. Mathematically you are correct but practically its a waste.

Photontek hung at 26.5" the gavita at 24" both in a 5x5 area. Wall watts is 753 vs 652. At only 100 more watts you get 1000ppfd with minumal drop. The gavita is maxed out at 700 with 122 ppfd at the corners. You think thats waist and you would pic the Gavita?? Gavita top picture Photontek bottom

 

[growsince79]

Photontek hung at 26.5" the gavita at 24" both in a 5x5 area. Wall watts is 753 vs 652. At only 100 more watts you get 1000ppfd with minumal drop. The gavita is maxed out at 700 with 122 ppfd at the corners. You think thats waist and you would pick the Gavita?? Gavita top pick Photontek bottom

I'd need a taller ceiling that beast.

 

[MedicalOnly]

I'd need a taller ceiling that beast.

8' should be plenty

 

[growsince79]

8' should be plenty

Way too much for me. my lil 2x4 makes more than enough. That light can supply my whole block.

 

[MedicalOnly]

Way too much for me. my lil 2x4 makes more than enough. That light can supply my whole block.

Im planning to get 2 for a 5x10 area lol i better get good sunglasses

 

[Frankster]

I'll figure it out , I did last harvest using my 16 bulb 5-5 fixtures at this point I'm NOT giving up on my DE I'm buying new hotilux bulbs and gonna kick ass as I try to always do , with success comes $ so being successful is the the key . I'm done on this subject , got bigger fish to fry . I getting ready to have to deal with state compliance , zoning , banned substances, I have no time to argue apples and oranges . I honestly came on here to help someone who really needs it to remind myself why I love what I do , and still have love for the plant . Thanks for your input .

LB

I think what you need is this; Like long strips, tacked to the top, and just widen out that grow space with the DE units.


I really think the 301H would work the best in this situation; and I wouldn't bring them online until the flowering stages, possibly. Depending on the veg needs. Get some 8 foot aluminum angle iron, and build 8 foot single light lines though the grow tent.... Use lab grade power supplies.

You could probably double your grow space (or half the DE output) and reduce your overall consumption by 30-50% or so.

 

[Aqua Man]

Photontek hung at 26.5" the gavita at 24" both in a 5x5 area. Wall watts is 753 vs 652. At only 100 more watts you get 1000ppfd with minumal drop. The gavita is maxed out at 700 with 122 ppfd at the corners. You think thats waist and you would pic the Gavita?? Gavita top picture Photontek bottom

Have a link to those charts?

 

[Frankster]

3x3 vs 5x5 for led

I really think par and ppfd only tells part of the story of what's going on. As Aquaman suggest, there's more at play here there not showing everything. It's not only output, (that's a big part) but light (color) temperature is key. Ratio of light frequency.

Light color is largely behind plant response, internodes, and various other signaling pathways. ie. chemical messengers.

That's where the LM301H standout from the pack above and beyond the rest of the field. There specifically constructed for this very specific horticultural purpose in mind. I've got some of both setups, so I can see the difference.

 

[growsince79]

Im planning to get 2 for a 5x10 area lol i better get good sunglasses

better get co2

 

[MedicalOnly]

Have a link to those charts?

For the gavita - scroll aways down

Best LED Grow Lights of 2021 Comparison & Review Test Using Laboratory Data

We're doing something no one has ever done before -- well, sort of. Each LED company that takes its craft seriously focuses on buying high-quality components that will last a long time (read: not fail within 2 years) and have high efficiency/output ratings

growershouse.com

The photontek

Photontek XT 1000W CO2 PRO PAR Test & Review - Coco For Cannabis

Photontek XT 1000w CO2 PRO Independent Grow Light Test and Review by Dr MJ Coco. Review, Video, PAR map, PPF & PPFD, Efficiency, Hanging Height, Harvest Est

www.cocoforcannabis.com

 

[MedicalOnly]

better get co2

Got two 20lb tanks just need the controller. Going to be a sealed room.

 

[growsince79]

Got two 20lb tanks just need the controller. Going to be a sealed room.

What do you figure it will produce yearly?

 

[MedicalOnly]

I really think par and ppfd only tells part of the story of what's going on. As Aquaman suggest, there's more at play here there not showing everything. It's not only output, (that's a big part) but light (color) temperature is key. Ratio of light frequency.

Light color is largely behind plant response, internodes, and various other signaling pathways. ie. chemical messengers.

That's where the LM301H standout from the pack above and beyond the rest of the field. There specifically constructed for this very specific horticultural purpose in mind. I've got some of both setups, so I can see the difference.

What are we debating here?

 

[Frankster]

Best lights =

What are we debating here?

Not debate so much as just highlighting some of the key factors that often are overlooked.

PPFD doesn't tell the whole story. The spectrum and behavior of plants under each different color of light is going to be vastly different. Especially when it comes to internodes, (length) ripening (timeframe), end weight, and flower complexity. THC content, oil % terpene production. Light color impacts all of these.

Lower (color) ie. 3000->3500 temp tend to perform better later in the grow, whereas higher (color) ie. 4500->5000 temp speed earlier growth, and there's a crossover that's dependent on developmental stage in question. ie. Veg light vs flower light. So when looking at your light prospects; you might want to take these considerations into account, (not just watts, and ppfd) there's a major difference in how the plants respond to these different colored spectrums.


These ratio's are key to optimizing plant growth, independent of intensity and ppfd.

 

[MedicalOnly]

What do you figure it will produce yearly?

6lbs every 4 months roughly. 7-8 if i go hydro

Im optimistic

 

[MedicalOnly]

Best lights =

just adding that ppfd doesn't tell the whole story. The spectrum and behavior of plants under each different color of light is going to be vastly different. Especially when it comes to internodes, and ripening length, weight, and flower complexity.

Lower (color) temps tend to perform better later in the grow, whereas higher (color) temps speed earlier growth, and there's a crossover that occurs dependent on developmental stage in question. So when looking at your light prospects; you might want to take these considerations into account, (not just watts, and ppfd) there's a major difference in how the plants respond to these different spectrums.


These ratio's are key to optimizing plant growth, independent of intensity and ppfd.

Yes definitely agree. Thats why adjustable spectrum leds for the win.

Output better fir yeild, spectrum for quality

 

[growsince79]

6lbs every 4 months roughly. 7-8 if i go hydro

Im optimistic

With that light and co2 I think you have to go hydro. Soil ain't gonna cut it.

 

[Frankster]

Yes definitely agree. Thats why adjustable spectrum leds for the win.

Output better fir yeild, spectrum for quality

I'd like to inspect what your speaking of specifically. If it's the color of the full spectrums; I'll agree, but if it's simply adding a bunch of red diodes, I would be leery.

660nm Osram's have limited utility IMO. I'm speaking of the (main) full spectrum temps, not ancillary lights. Specs matter.

Then when you digest that part well, I would suggest researching and study how lighting angles; how spreading out ppfd can improve overall penetration. Further improving overall efficiency.


Say if we could bust our sun up into 1000 little suns, then orbit them all around the earth much closer... (say at moon level) all from different angles. We would need a fraction of the suns power... We could light the entire world with array of asteroid sized, or maybe even basketball sized suns. With a fraction of the power required.

LEDs have very specific angles, usually 120 degrees are considered optimum, I think. But not all of that angle is as intense as it gets in the center spot. So moving the diode apart is helpful to balance this effect. The closer, and farther apart is optimum (up to a point).

Every grow can be optimized specifically for it's footprint.

 

[lbezy]

Frank , fuck it I'm gonna buy 4 top of line led and see if the savings in electric is worth it . I remember 2012 or 2013 with my buddy and I did and undercurrent system and ran it side by side with cocoa and guess which one you even more the cocoa so we tore out the the under current out the next day. This was the room

 

[lbezy]

I'm done arguing