Road Kill Skunk - Ester Alcohols, Train-wreck and the Catpiss Connection

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ChemmyChem

ChemmyChem

3
3
Nice brother thanks for sharing this! It was a long read but I don't mind my post was long too. I like hearing peoples stories of the super skunky old days. The way you describe that Afghani from school is very reminiscent of my early kush years. I am late 90s early 2000s that was around when I was in HS and I remember many similar humorous times where the herb would skunk bomb the room. Being from SoCal we had a ton of Kush this is the land of OG and even though the newer strains here are all fruitier now every once in a while you will find someone with that old school Kush that reeks the room. The Afghani lineage in the kush line can be very skunky if you get a good one. But the key is it's gotta be old school genetics. Dark green leaves and super loud.

Also it can partially be the way that the herb is grown. Im not saying this is the main reason skunk is gone I truly believe its the lost genetics primarily but I do believe that herb grown outdoors or also indoors under HPS will give you a louder and more skunky terp profile. This has to do with the full spectrum UV range. I can attest to this because as my profile name states I run a lot of SoCal outdoor but I also have a killer indoor tent rig. I am running LEDs however I also supplement with UV Reptile bulbs so that I can broaden the UV spectrum. Its a very high end light the HLG Scorpion Diablo board and my flowers come out rock hard however I will attest that the outdoor runs usually come out skunkier than the indoor. However the bag appeal on the outdoor is always lower than the indoor. The outdoor is always leafier and a bit different in color but man does it stink! Im glad you mentioned that Death-star I haven't smoked it before but a bunch of heads have mentioned it. AKBB has it available I think Im gonna give it a try I recently bought a bunch of other stuff. Im about to germinate 3 different skunk strains all from KY along with a legit old school Train Wreck and some 90's Catpiss thats supposed to be loud as fuck! My skunk hunt is really heating up. To this day the old school OG still reigns supreme its always the skunkiest shit in my mix however Im hoping these other old school strains Im about to run will kick my Kush off the thrown. I love how you gave a shoutout to the SoCal kush this is my Fire OG kush below. One is outdoor the other indoor. Im actually running this as we speak in my garage and every time my heater turns on at night the garage air gets sucked into my house and you can smell it inside the house. So much for carbon. Im on day 50 right now and my wife is starting to complain that the house is smelling now LOL 😂

Fire OG Kush outdoor run last year...
View attachment 1246913

Fire OG Kush current indoor run day 50...
View attachment 1246917
View attachment 1246918

XXX OG Kush current indoor run day 50...
View attachment 1246919
Good shit dude that outdoor plant is stacked and the indoor is super caked. Im definitely going to get some afghanis going the ones ive found in southern oregon were lack luster. Right now i got a shit ton of chemdog, sour d, og(triangle kush and SFV) and headband crosses going. Also some gmo crosses and some fire randos like 87 Limepop, 88 Hashplant, Yuzu Sherbert and some others. Trying to find the stupid loud cut with the strongest esters n terps no matter the yield and also the highest yielder thats still fire .
 
Backyard_Boogie

Backyard_Boogie

977
143
That sounds killer I love the chems and sours too over the years I have had the fortunate opportunity to blaze pretty much all the classics and I love me the chem lines. Right now I have these San Diego Catpiss seeds going and they are little teen plants. I was defoliating the lowers yesterday and just the dried crinkled water leaves made my hands reek. The stem rub is no joke maybe the loudest rub I have smelled it boarderline nasty I think those are gonna stink to high hell. I will give a smoke report as they develop it’s real 1990 SD catpiss x Original OG Kush
 
ChemmyChem

ChemmyChem

3
3
That sounds killer I love the chems and sours too over the years I have had the fortunate opportunity to blaze pretty much all the classics and I love me the chem lines. Right now I have these San Diego Catpiss seeds going and they are little teen plants. I was defoliating the lowers yesterday and just the dried crinkled water leaves made my hands reek. The stem rub is no joke maybe the loudest rub I have smelled it boarderline nasty I think those are gonna stink to high hell. I will give a smoke report as they develop it’s real 1990 SD catpiss x Original OG Kush
Hell yea you know its some loud when the veg plants reek. I had a Skunk 1 x Cinex cut called PDX forever and oddly enough every time the skunk smell started banging from outside the veg room it meant that the tray of PDX cuts had rooted.
Just ran into a weird issue that my partner and guys at the grow store arent sure about. So about 10 days ago I took some SUUPPERR healthy plants from my indoor spot to my outdoor spot to begin to hardy them off for the outdoor season. At first they were rocking and growing extremely fast after the first 2 days of the sun hardy process. Then, slowly i noticed a couple stalks slowly purpling and the tops near the purpling stalks are a little paler then they should be and a little "scrunchy" looking. At first i chalked it up to just being in a new environment thats not quite as dialed as my indoor. Then as the days went on more of them started to do it. So i did a nice dry out, slf-100 flush, then yesterday i gave em 5ml/gal of Botanicare CalMag+. About to go check on em now and im gonna try n get some pics soon. Any ideas on what the hell this is? it looks like cold stress but even the other day when it froze outside it didnt get below 50-55 in the new veg room that i use while the plants are still hardying off. my partner thinks its just a little stress from being introducd to the sun, but i am hardying them very carefully. day 1 was 2 hours of sun, then 3, then 4, and so on. now theyre on 6 hrs of sun for today. please let me know this shit is weird and i was going to plant them june 1st now its tentative! thanks
 
D

dx4

1
1
what a great thread thanks for sharing all that figure maybe i could throw a couple ideas out here. i think the esters ether aldehydes ketones oxygenated terpenoids can still be found, but not in indoor inbred lines. the missing factor is the results of domestication. terpenes esters even cannabinoids they all serve a purpose for the plant, a defense weapon usually against bugs fungi bacteria etc. while all plants produce a base set of terpenes, an induced set also exists which becomes irrelevant inside. these are called induced oleoresins.

a good example is korean conifer trees and delta carene. a healthy pine has nearly 0 delta carene. however, upon attack by a pine wilt nematode, huge amounts of carene are released. now im not saying we have to infect our plants, but even inside we can mimic these relationships by using hormones or simulating insect attacks. methyl jasmonate is the alarm hormone plants use which is activated by an attack, and in turn activates these oleoresins. chitin is a ground up mix of beetle shells and insides. when a plant root system comes in contact, they think an attack is happening, increase their hormone alarm and release oleoresin. both of these ingredients are safe to use and fairly inexpensive.
i think its interesting that rks was seen alot in the uncle fester sk18, which was torture tested to become a pest resistant line. to make it bulletproof it was intentionally infected/attacked/neglected by the breeders. now this brings me to concepts like epigenetics and methylation. these are adjustments to regulation of genes which are inheritable, but also have an on/off component. they also dont show up in dna tests. instead they work thru gene and synthase transcription. basically a sort of memory or switch board for the plants defense system.
in the 60s regardless of the line, many p1 plants were very generationally close to their home/adapted environment whether that be feral or farmed. since these epigenetics and hormone alarms can be inherited the first few generations would continue to act as it normally would. but either due to a milder climate or a trip inside, the plants would slowly silence or adjust these switches to the muted forms we see today. now trainwreck i believe was built with a lowland thai which comes from a harsh environment. so it makes sense that they would be keyed up to provide those amazing qualities you described. one thing i like to do is search for different uses the plant has for certain aromatic elements, like the carene example. sulfur compounds, amines etc are probly a big piece of the puzzle. with all the access we have to different heirlooms, landraces it could be helpful to infuse certain stinky lines into domesticated lines with potential, to awaken their wild side. so thanks for all the great info!!
 
shaganja

shaganja

1,158
163
Heard a breeder on the potcast with heavy daze, say that r.k.s. was more of an era. A few strains had this Ester acrid smell to them, but the crowd started to breed for sweet skunk instead of the acrid fuely skunk, to keep from getting busted. He said we need to go back to breeding for the dank, acrid now that it is legal in many states.
 
Backyard_Boogie

Backyard_Boogie

977
143
what a great thread thanks for sharing all that figure maybe i could throw a couple ideas out here. i think the esters ether aldehydes ketones oxygenated terpenoids can still be found, but not in indoor inbred lines. the missing factor is the results of domestication. terpenes esters even cannabinoids they all serve a purpose for the plant, a defense weapon usually against bugs fungi bacteria etc. while all plants produce a base set of terpenes, an induced set also exists which becomes irrelevant inside. these are called induced oleoresins.

a good example is korean conifer trees and delta carene. a healthy pine has nearly 0 delta carene. however, upon attack by a pine wilt nematode, huge amounts of carene are released. now im not saying we have to infect our plants, but even inside we can mimic these relationships by using hormones or simulating insect attacks. methyl jasmonate is the alarm hormone plants use which is activated by an attack, and in turn activates these oleoresins. chitin is a ground up mix of beetle shells and insides. when a plant root system comes in contact, they think an attack is happening, increase their hormone alarm and release oleoresin. both of these ingredients are safe to use and fairly inexpensive.
i think its interesting that rks was seen alot in the uncle fester sk18, which was torture tested to become a pest resistant line. to make it bulletproof it was intentionally infected/attacked/neglected by the breeders. now this brings me to concepts like epigenetics and methylation. these are adjustments to regulation of genes which are inheritable, but also have an on/off component. they also dont show up in dna tests. instead they work thru gene and synthase transcription. basically a sort of memory or switch board for the plants defense system.
in the 60s regardless of the line, many p1 plants were very generationally close to their home/adapted environment whether that be feral or farmed. since these epigenetics and hormone alarms can be inherited the first few generations would continue to act as it normally would. but either due to a milder climate or a trip inside, the plants would slowly silence or adjust these switches to the muted forms we see today. now trainwreck i believe was built with a lowland thai which comes from a harsh environment. so it makes sense that they would be keyed up to provide those amazing qualities you described. one thing i like to do is search for different uses the plant has for certain aromatic elements, like the carene example. sulfur compounds, amines etc are probly a big piece of the puzzle. with all the access we have to different heirlooms, landraces it could be helpful to infuse certain stinky lines into domesticated lines with potential, to awaken their wild side. so thanks for all the great info!!
Great stuff my man thanks for sharing this! Yes I agree with you! The super strong acrid ester smells very well could have originated in nature as an evolutionary response to environment or herbivory. This is why everyone is hoping that they will find a bagseed of that old skunk that hasn't been crossed with anything new or fruity everyone is looking for that old-school acrid skunk. It was probably crossed with some sativa in there in the distant past and it was likely the wild genetics from nature that made those older skunks so amazing before they were bred with the fruity shit.

Another thing you mentioned that is worth further discussion is the sulfur compounds I agree once again this is a huge piece of the puzzle that Im just now beginning to learn about. Others in this thread have commented on the sulfur component. One thing that I didn't mention about my Train-Wreck grow back in college is the soil medium that I used. I know those original Train-Wreck Piss genetics I scored were absolute fire but one of the reasons why my terpenes were unreal on that old grow was because I accidentally did a couple things right that all happened to line up. I was kinda broke at the time so I didn't buy a pre-made store bought soil mix. I had some shitty compost soil it was woody and chunky low grade garbage I think it was the Kellogg brand from Home Depot. Anyways it was leftover from my dads tomato garden so I decided to use that cuz it was free. Then I gathered some free dirt (illegally btw lol) I just went over to the nature preserve area by my house and I went over in the corner by the ice plants and used a hand shovel to scoop up some rock hard SoCal clay dirt. The dirt here is hard to bust through then underneath it has a reddish rusty color. It's primarily clay and Im sure it has lots of minerals in it. Anyways the rookie that I was at the time I simply mixed the SoCal clay dirt and the chunky cheap compost together and that was what I used to grow that Train-Wreck. So looking back on this now it was the natural soil that I used that was the key. I will explain you see the undisturbed soil here has a biological living crust on the top. It's like living fungi and bacteria most places in nature has live fungi. And furthermore the soil layer underneath the crust layer has a different color and it has a little smell to it kinda like sulfur. This is because the spot that I dug up the soil was back behind the wetlands near the beach but that area is a tad bit marshy so I think the deeper clay layers had bacteria living in it giving it that smell. So even though the clay soil was thick and unsuitable by itself I mixed it with that chunky compost which added drainage. Happy accident at the time. So this was the trifecta as to why I think that grow was so amazing it was these three things that lined up...

1) Badass oldschool genetics that had ester qualities
2) Accidentally mixed a fantastic blend of natural living soil with mycorrhizal fungi and bacteria and sulfur already in it. With proper drainage.
3) I ran it under HPS because this was before LED

Like I said I have ran a TON of plants in the years since this and Im still chasing those old terpenes. Nothing I have ran since is even remotely close its so frustrating. It would be like if you'r a golfer and on the very first time to the golf course you hit an unbelievable hole in one. Then after a lifetime of work you still cant duplicate that first game. Total beginners luck I admit I just wish I could recreate it again. I would probably tear up if I smelled terpenes like that again its a dam crying shame they are lost... 😭
 
Backyard_Boogie

Backyard_Boogie

977
143
Heard a breeder on the potcast with heavy daze, say that r.k.s. was more of an era. A few strains had this Ester acrid smell to them, but the crowd started to breed for sweet skunk instead of the acrid fuely skunk, to keep from getting busted. He said we need to go back to breeding for the dank, acrid now that it is legal in many states.
Yep this is exactly what happened everyone was afraid of getting busted and they bred that fruity shit in there instead of the acrid smell. It sucks that the real shit is gone hopefully someone will find it soon!
 
D

dx4.1

1
1
your insights are right on the money. heres some cool info for you on sulfur compounds in cannabis. i normally dont like hype strains, but having grown gelato 33 it def reeks.


the first link is an article summary the second is the full paper. continuing on the soil, not only the content of fungi/bacteria facilitates, but also the swampy nature comes into play as well. using skunk cabbage as a comparison, the sulfur compounds thrive in acidic aerobic environments. so the boggy ness is key. now calcium oxalate is mentioned in the article as a key component of the skunk cabbage leaf which aids in plant protect, but also encourages the formation of these compounds. now a lot of plants which have volatile sulfur compounds deploy them in order to attract specific rare pollinators ie beetles and flies as opposed to bees butterfly etc. the carrion odor produced for these pollinators mimic smell of dead/decaying odors which these pollinators thrive on. in fact skunk cabbage is thermogenic- able to produce its own heat source which increases the range and content of these compounds for attraction. in this way the hps and high temperatures mentioned certainly amplified the smells. i find it interesting that kentucky/ohio/ virginia were many times the source of these rks acclimated lines. in the 1800s chinese hemp was brought in to kentucky. this is relevant because asian hemp as been shown to produce piperdine, which as a member of the amine family has incredibly pungent smell and attracts flies. is it possible that there was admixture with the afghan/mexican hybrids in these areas? and did the specific anaerobic bacteria in the swampy environment cause the skunk lines to transform and metabolize these asian hemp like profiles.

the article also points out the similarity between garlic/onion and skunk smell. these profiles are found in guerrero landraces, and according the sam the ratman, the Colombian gold x afghan hybrid was put to aco gold as the final step for sk1. since a golds close proximity to guerrero , maybe the Mexican component is more important .mountain organics has the real deal a gold and has used "beaver musk" to describe its profile. outside of the roadkill name, rks description sometimes skips over the skunk part. to me, the immediate and drastic skunk musk odor of roadkill is mostly due to all of the skunk musk being released at once due to the pressure of being run over. sulfur compounds and amines in plants are designed to attract far away pollinators in plants in the same way a skunks spray is immediately detected in animals as a deterrent. very cool research man
 
Backyard_Boogie

Backyard_Boogie

977
143
Came across this in my late night seedbank wanderings.

"This phenotype is the Closest to the 1990’s Original Catpiss that we were growing in San Diego. This one has that wet pissy ammonia and skunk smell you all are looking for. Big resinous colas and another great washer."

https://dagga.garden/product/san-di...s-cut-kosher-kush-dna-x-original-90s-catpiss/
Guess what my friend? Crazy coincidence Im already running this as we speak! This is the EXACT pheno that I purchased its the "Kosher Kitty - Amys cut" this is the one that I mentioned in this thread a little further back. Its real 90s catpiss x Kosher Kush. If you skim through you will see that I was talking about the 90s catpiss and how my stem rubs and water-leafs absolutely reek. This is the one Im talking about so far probably loudest stem rub I have ever experienced I cant wait to get these little teen plants in flower. I watched the whole interview and debate on the James Loud show Catpiss episode as seen below. This is where I found out about these breeders. I have some really promising stuff Im running as we speak. Im running multiple strains of vintage catpiss along with 2 different vintage KY skunks. Also some REAL Trainwreck and Piff sativa and haze stuff. Im going old school fellas nothing newer than the 1990s Im trying to source piss piff and skunk genes that have NOT been tampered or crossed with anything new and fruity. Im also gonna try to grow the old stuff in sulfur rich organic living soil to awaken the terpene beast.

 
Last edited:
bulletxs

bulletxs

62
33
I skimmed this thread so apologies if I’ve missed it but oldschoolchronic is linked with blueskiesvienna who is a known scammer of RKS. He claims he got seeds from old timer1 himself who called out his bs. They’ve collectively scammed people out of thousands on the “boss packs” pushed by both of them. Plenty of documented threads on other forums and not 1 single skunk or rks leaning pheno found. RKS is gone, it is well documented from Samtheskunkman that you will never find RKS again as he spent nearly 20 years breeding it out.
 
Backyard_Boogie

Backyard_Boogie

977
143
I skimmed this thread so apologies if I’ve missed it but oldschoolchronic is linked with blueskiesvienna who is a known scammer of RKS. He claims he got seeds from old timer1 himself who called out his bs. They’ve collectively scammed people out of thousands on the “boss packs” pushed by both of them. Plenty of documented threads on other forums and not 1 single skunk or rks leaning pheno found. RKS is gone, it is well documented from Samtheskunkman that you will never find RKS again as he spent nearly 20 years breeding it out.
Yes you are correct that Blueskiesvienna is a confirmed scammer. I think that him and JR from oldschoolchronic did work together a while back for a short while however they both have mad beef with each-other now. They are no longer affiliated in any way with each other. Kentucky Organics also was working with oldschoolchronic and now he and JR have beef too. So basically what I have come to find out is that every single breeder that utters the phrase RKS will instantly go into fisticuffs with every other breeder and the community. Natures Farm apparently had uncle fester RKS and that was a scam. Dominion seeds was the next one and that is a scam too! It's the curse of the RKS! Don't say it 3 times in a row its like Bloody Mary bro it will cast voodoo and upset forum boards if anyone dares to claim it. From my perspective I think almost everyone on Instagram is an idiot and all of their comments should be taken with a grain of salt. I don't put the names or labels on anything anymore Im just looking for skunky weed I can care less who grew it or what they want to call it! 😂
 
Tasty Buds

Tasty Buds

1,625
263
I think I got pretty close on the middle head
20220523 030007
Image
20220601 002605
Image
20220527 025758
 
shaganja

shaganja

1,158
163
your insights are right on the money. heres some cool info for you on sulfur compounds in cannabis. i normally dont like hype strains, but having grown gelato 33 it def reeks.


the first link is an article summary the second is the full paper. continuing on the soil, not only the content of fungi/bacteria facilitates, but also the swampy nature comes into play as well. using skunk cabbage as a comparison, the sulfur compounds thrive in acidic aerobic environments. so the boggy ness is key. now calcium oxalate is mentioned in the article as a key component of the skunk cabbage leaf which aids in plant protect, but also encourages the formation of these compounds. now a lot of plants which have volatile sulfur compounds deploy them in order to attract specific rare pollinators ie beetles and flies as opposed to bees butterfly etc. the carrion odor produced for these pollinators mimic smell of dead/decaying odors which these pollinators thrive on. in fact skunk cabbage is thermogenic- able to produce its own heat source which increases the range and content of these compounds for attraction. in this way the hps and high temperatures mentioned certainly amplified the smells. i find it interesting that kentucky/ohio/ virginia were many times the source of these rks acclimated lines. in the 1800s chinese hemp was brought in to kentucky. this is relevant because asian hemp as been shown to produce piperdine, which as a member of the amine family has incredibly pungent smell and attracts flies. is it possible that there was admixture with the afghan/mexican hybrids in these areas? and did the specific anaerobic bacteria in the swampy environment cause the skunk lines to transform and metabolize these asian hemp like profiles.

the article also points out the similarity between garlic/onion and skunk smell. these profiles are found in guerrero landraces, and according the sam the ratman, the Colombian gold x afghan hybrid was put to aco gold as the final step for sk1. since a golds close proximity to guerrero , maybe the Mexican component is more important .mountain organics has the real deal a gold and has used "beaver musk" to describe its profile. outside of the roadkill name, rks description sometimes skips over the skunk part. to me, the immediate and drastic skunk musk odor of roadkill is mostly due to all of the skunk musk being released at once due to the pressure of being run over. sulfur compounds and amines in plants are designed to attract far away pollinators in plants in the same way a skunks spray is immediately detected in animals as a deterrent. very cool research man
Interesting. I thought it was an afgani landrace. a cross of two afganis, or more?
 
F

FloraKing

3
3
Also seeds for "Zombie Feet Skunk. The ultimate fantasy of skunk"
I bought some even though I was skeptical because he didn’t have any pics on either one of his ig or on his website. Tbh I think he just gave me his ssh catpiss and I also received freebie pack of his red hair skunk. Shit reeks and almost smells like cocaine and jet fuel. Not bad but I just won’t run the breeding project I had lined up because I don’t know what it truly is.
 
Backyard_Boogie

Backyard_Boogie

977
143
I bought some even though I was skeptical because he didn’t have any pics on either one of his ig or on his website. Tbh I think he just gave me his ssh catpiss and I also received freebie pack of his red hair skunk. Shit reeks and almost smells like cocaine and jet fuel. Not bad but I just won’t run the breeding project I had lined up because I don’t know what it truly is.
Im running his SSH Catpiss BX2 and BX3 right now Im still in veg. I also have his Hellraiser OG and a pure Sativa strain I got from him. All started from cuts but nothing has been flowered yet. I also have some other different stuff Im running I got 2 different legit vintage Kentucky skunk strains and also got 90s catpiss kush cross and then I got real Arcata TrainWreck. Got Legit vintage NL#5 seeds and some Crippy going too. Too much to list. Im Pheno hunting everything hard Im only gonna keep the best specimens I find out of dozens of strains. 😎 🤘🔥
 
Backyard_Boogie

Backyard_Boogie

977
143
I bought some even though I was skeptical because he didn’t have any pics on either one of his ig or on his website. Tbh I think he just gave me his ssh catpiss and I also received freebie pack of his red hair skunk. Shit reeks and almost smells like cocaine and jet fuel. Not bad but I just won’t run the breeding project I had lined up because I don’t know what it truly is.
BTW I forgot to mention let me know how that Red Hair skunk turns out that he gave you. I have been eyeing that one he posts on Instagram all the time and the pics of his recent Red Hair Skunk grow look very unique. If its bomb you should PM me perhaps you and I can do a clone trade. I love the coloring to me seems more like an orange hair skunk but either way this is what it looks like very pretty...

Screen Shot 2022 06 07 at 61029 PM
 

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