Thrips to black spots to leaf tips curling up in week 4 flower

[Turkish980]

Slurry test use 2 to 1 , water to soil, take it from halfway down or so, not the top stir very well, let it sit 15 minutes stir again and then take both readings

That's why I asked because I thought you had the slurry & the RO test mixed up

A slurry test is much more accurate picture of what's going on in your soil

I also think you might have your 500/700 scale mixed up? the person I just saw who may use the 700 scale (or at least he's helped me understand it before because I only use the 500 scale) is posting now, maybe he can help you, let me ask mr Michigan if he's available?! @MIMedGrower

I am pretty sure your soil pH is low & your newts are built up very high in that soil, and when you get a soil slurry test finished post results of both pH and PPM

Will do, thank you for the info. The only problem I have with going halfway down is, I'm not sure I can? I am coming across roots at the very top of my soil layer as well. And if he does, I have been watching the ocg fam videos and from what I gathered it sounds like the Nectar for the gods goes along the 700 path. Altho they did state as long as you remain consistent in your measurements, not sure it matters all that much?

Attaching a pic of my soil base. You can see a bit of the roots. I just wouldn't want to damage anything going that far down. Again, I'm a newb at this so I'm not sure if people still do with that amount of roots

 

[Beachwalker]

What I'm trying to tell you is by following the nutrient manufacturers feeding schedule you've over fed your plants, they all seem to recommend about twice what a plant really needs and should therefore imo be ignored

what you posted for your PPM & runoff readings (140ppm / 7. pH) does not sound consistent with what you've said and what's your plan shows me

your soils pH is now likely low and your p.p.m. is high & most likely is your issue & why your plants are burning, so do a soil slurry test to confirm this, and then to determine the next step


Edit: I have grown in Fox Farm soil over 4 years, you will not hurt your plant by taking a small soil sample the size of a teaspoon or a tablespoon a few inches down, you will hurt your plant if you don't get this issue fixed, but if you decide not to take the slurry test I want to wish you the best of luck either way, regardless of what you decide!

Also did you put some kind of a mulch on top of the soil because I see no or very little perlite at all and Fox Farm has perlite in it

 

[Turkish980]

What I'm trying to tell you is by following the nutrient manufacturers feeding schedule you've over fed your plants, they all seem to recommend about twice what a plant really needs and should therefore imo be ignored

what you posted for your PPM & runoff readings (140ppm / 7. pH) does not sound consistent with what you've said and what's your plan shows me

your soils pH is now likely low and your p.p.m. is high & most likely is your issue & why your plants are burning, so do a soil slurry test to confirm this, and then to determine the next step


Edit: I have grown in Fox Farm soil over 4 years, you will not hurt your plant by taking a small soil sample the size of a teaspoon or a tablespoon a few inches down, you will hurt your plant if you don't get this issue fixed, but if you decide not to take the slurry test I want to wish you the best of luck either way, regardless of what you decide!

Also did you put some kind of a mulch on top of the soil because I see no or very little perlite at all and Fox Farm has perlite in it

I will do the slurry. I did not add any additional soil supplements. Just the fox f

What I'm trying to tell you is by following the nutrient manufacturers feeding schedule you've over fed your plants, they all seem to recommend about twice what a plant really needs and should therefore imo be ignored

what you posted for your PPM & runoff readings (140ppm / 7. pH) does not sound consistent with what you've said and what's your plan shows me

your soils pH is now likely low and your p.p.m. is high & most likely is your issue & why your plants are burning, so do a soil slurry test to confirm this, and then to determine the next step


Edit: I have grown in Fox Farm soil over 4 years, you will not hurt your plant by taking a small soil sample the size of a teaspoon or a tablespoon a few inches down, you will hurt your plant if you don't get this issue fixed, but if you decide not to take the slurry test I want to wish you the best of luck either way, regardless of what you decide!

Also did you put some kind of a mulch on top of the soil because I see no or very little perlite at all and Fox Farm has perlite in it

Thank you.

I'll do the soil slurry today. Probably within the hour. I last flushed yesterday afternoon. No, I didn't use any additional additives in the soil, just fox farm ocean forest. Perhaps the nutes discolored it? (probably a stupid statement). Not too sure tho.

 

[Turkish980]

Slurry completed. Did a 2 to 1 water to soil. Stirred, waited 15 min, and stirred again
Pls let me know if I should have gone down farther.

 

[MIMedGrower]

Slurry test use 2 to 1 , water to soil, take it from halfway down or so, not the top stir very well, let it sit 15 minutes stir again and then take both readings

That's why I asked because I thought you had the slurry & the RO test mixed up

A slurry test is much more accurate picture of what's going on in your soil

I also think you might have your 500/700 scale mixed up? the person I just saw who may use the 700 scale (or at least he's helped me understand it before because I only use the 500 scale) is posting now, maybe he can help you, let me ask mr Michigan if he's available?! @MIMedGrower

I am pretty sure your soil pH is low & your newts are built up very high in that soil, and when you get a soil slurry test finished post results of both pH and PPM

I only use ec. Which 1.0 ec equals 500ppm.

I always ignored botanicare numbers. They are figured at .7 factor.

Every grower should ec or .5 factor in my opinion.

 

[Beachwalker]

Slurry completed. Did a 2 to 1 water to soil. Stirred, waited 15 min, and stirred again
Pls let me know if I should have gone down farther.

Okay so your numbers are strange, yes I would have liked you to go down further, even if you went down the side of the pot with a spoon (I use a tablespoon) then turn the spoon inward and take your scoop that way, that's what I do and seems to work fine, that way you're further down and you're in a little bit and you're not really messing with the roots much

Have you sprayed anything lately??

Agree you should use ec or 500 scale (I use 500, it's all I have on my little blue cheapy metre)

let's see if we can get you some more help because you've got me confused right now, cuz your numbers should have been like 5.2 + 1500 PPM & would have explained that burning and I'm not seeing that with your slurry test? @Aqua Man @Dirtbag @One drop

 

[Turkish980]

Okay so your numbers are strange, yes I would have liked you to go down further, even if you went down the side of the pot with a spoon (I use a tablespoon) then turn the spoon inward and take your scoop that way, that's what I do and seems to work fine, that way you're further down and you're in a little bit and you're not really messing with the roots much

Have you sprayed anything lately??

Agree you should use ec or 500 scale (I use 500, it's all I have on my little blue cheapy metre)

let's see if we can get you some more help because you've got me confused right now, cuz your numbers should have been like 5.2 + 1500 PPM & would have explained that burning and I'm not seeing that with your slurry test? @Aqua Man @Dirtbag @One drop

I can definitely go down farther on the side and try that as well. I'll do another slurry shortly. I had quite a few thrips (came from a friend who i later found out has those) and I may have mis identified some of the damage I was seeing. Once I saw some buds starting to brown at the tip of the pistils and seem to wither away, I thought the thrip infestation was pretty bad at that point and thought unless I did something, I may not harvest. I reluctantly sprayed organocide one time at the end of week 1 flower and I did that 20 minutes before lights out. But besides that, no treatments in flower. I do have a cheap blue ppm meter as well. That one would usually come out to 740ish ppm. I assume that would reads at500

Also, I can change it to ec and start doing my readings that way. I did read that seems to be the best method. Just a little equation needed.

 

[Beachwalker]

I can definitely go down farther on the side and try that as well. I'll do another slurry shortly. I had quite a few thrips (came from a friend who i later found out has those) and I may have mis identified some of the damage I was seeing. Once I saw some buds starting to brown at the tip of the pistils and seem to wither away, I thought the thrip infestation was pretty bad at that point and thought unless I did something, I may not harvest. I reluctantly sprayed organocide one time at the end of week 1 flower and I did that 20 minutes before lights out. But besides that, no treatments in flower. I do have a cheap blue ppm meter as well. That one would usually come out to 740ish ppm. I assume that would reads at500

Also, I can change it to ec and start doing my readings that way. I did read that seems to be the best method. Just a little equation needed.

@Ina ..trying to think of a few more big guns, these people are mostly professional horticulturist in one form or another who I'm tagging in, I've been doing this a long time, but these are the people I go to and I read when I'm stumpped(which is often), so maybe we can get you fixed before much longer, wished I saw your thread Sunday before it got much worse but we're here and going forward will get this fixed for you just don't feed anything right now except plain pH 6.5 water until you get a handle on what's causing this

In case I missed your answer did you spray anything or did you add anything unusual in the last week - 10 days?

 

[Turkish980]

@Ina ..trying to think of a few more big guns, these people are mostly professional horticulturist in one form or another who I'm tagging in, I've been doing this a long time, but these are the people I go to and I read when I'm stumpped(which is often), so maybe we can get you fixed before much longer, wished I saw your thread Sunday before it got much worse but we're here and going forward will get this fixed for you just don't feed anything right now except plain pH 6.5 water until you get a handle on what's causing this

In case I missed your answer did you spray anything or did you add anything unusual in the last week - 10 days?

Appreciate it! Yeah I did at the end of week 1 flower with organocide 20 min before lights out. I mentioned in the last reply with more info on why. But last week - 10 days no. I guess it's still sort of close to your timeframe, but would it be delayed like that? I'll keep just doing water for now and I'll be doing a slurry further down on the side shortly.

 

[Beachwalker]

Appreciate it! Yeah I did at the end of week 1 flower with organocide 20 min before lights out. I mentioned in the last reply with more info on why. But last week - 10 days no. I guess it's still sort of close to your timeframe, but would it be delayed like that? I'll keep just doing water for now and I'll be doing a slurry further down on the side shortly.

That might have a lot to do with it? the person I read who's seems to have a good handle on the various chemicals and additives and could probably help you hear is mr Haze @Burned Haze

After coffee I'll look up your product and see if that could have done it, in the meantime what ratio did you apply it?? (I'm hoping you're going to say as directed)

 

[Turkish980]

That might have a lot to do with it? the person I read who's seems to have a good handle on the various chemicals and additives and could probably help you hear is mr Haze @Burned Haze

After coffee I'll look up your product and see if that could have done it, in the meantime what ratio did you apply it?? (I'm hoping you're going to say as directed)

Thank's for the assistance. I did not buy the concentrate, I got it in the premixed ready to go spray bottle form and just covered the leaves top and bottom as directed. I had thought of that being something that could have affected it also, just seemed delayed. Although me being inexperienced, that could just be normal.

 

[Beachwalker]

Don't necessarily think it's inexperience, I don't know what it is for sure but would like to see you take a scoop at least halfway down the side between the dirt and the pot and get some dirt from way down and let me know what those slurry test numbers are because your numbers and what the plants showing just don't jibe

I'll look it up your chemical later I'm taking a break from yard work right now but you say you applied it has directed that should be fine; did you apply it with the lights on?

 

[Kanzeon]

Could part of the problem be an adverse reaction to running humidity that low during the day?

"Once the plant gets dry for too long, and that waxy cuticle layer is thin or totally gone, the leaf becomes nothing but a host for whatever pathogen happens to be floating by, photosynthesis stops, and the leaf becomes nothing more than a drain on the plant’s energy.

I would make the comparison to trying to grow a cannabis plant in too dry of an environment, as the same as trying to drive a car across a desert with just water and no antifreeze/coolant in the radiator, you may make it, but it's way more prone to overheat, and while you plant may make it through a dry environment, it's more than likely to have problems associated with lack of humidity."

https://growmag.com/todd-mccormick/

It looks like some of the leaf spots might be where the water was pulled from the the leaves by the osmotic pressure created by the high heat, low humidity environment and the constant air circulation. Leaves curl like this when they dry, right?

 

[Turkish980]

Don't necessarily think it's inexperience, I don't know what it is for sure but would like to see you take a scoop at least halfway down the side between the dirt and the pot and get some dirt from way down and let me know what those slurry test numbers are because your numbers and what the plants showing just don't jibe

I'll look it up your chemical later I'm taking a break from yard work right now but you say you applied it has directed that should be fine; did you apply it with the lights on?

I'll give it a shot today. I can give a pic of the front of the bottle if the listed ingredients help. I did not apply it with the lights on. I had taken it out of the tent to spray and then I put it back in. The most the light might have been on for afterwards is maybe 10-20 minutes before shutting off for the night.

 

[Turkish980]

Could part of the problem be an adverse reaction to running humidity that low during the day?

"Once the plant gets dry for too long, and that waxy cuticle layer is thin or totally gone, the leaf becomes nothing but a host for whatever pathogen happens to be floating by, photosynthesis stops, and the leaf becomes nothing more than a drain on the plant’s energy.

I would make the comparison to trying to grow a cannabis plant in too dry of an environment, as the same as trying to drive a car across a desert with just water and no antifreeze/coolant in the radiator, you may make it, but it's way more prone to overheat, and while you plant may make it through a dry environment, it's more than likely to have problems associated with lack of humidity."

https://growmag.com/todd-mccormick/

It looks like some of the leaf spots might be where the water was pulled from the the leaves by the osmotic pressure created by the high heat, low humidity environment and the constant air circulation. Leaves curl like this when they dry, right?

Something I haven't thought of. Not too sure. I could lower my inline fan speed. Would that help? I can run it speeds 1-10. I normally have it around 7-8. Photo was taken while light is still off

 

[Edinburgh]

I have been useing fox farm for 9 years, you have to add pearlite for airation or your mix will be to heavy, you want it nice and spongy so the roots can grow well, yea they put a bit of pearlite in mix but not enough on its own you have to add more when you make up your mix, as far as thrips are you shure, if so you have to address that problem imedidetley, i was running gelato and somehow got thrips, i put a micro drop of dawn in a spray bottle and gave plant a bath, i allso let my soil dry and sprinkled de earth around plant and left for 72 hours i even dusted all the fans useing a piece of tissue, de eath is dust and must be kept dry or it wont work, after 72 hours flush plant lightly and check ph. This plant had thrips and that is how i cured the problem. De earth is organic and will kill any bug with an exoskeleton if used correctly it can be bought at any hardware store and is dirt cheap, the dawn bath made the leaves unpalatable to the thrips, that and the de cured problem.

 

[Kanzeon]

Couldn't hurt to lower the fan speed for a bit. Try it and see how they like it?

The less ventilation, the higher the humidity from transpiration will be.

 

[Beachwalker]

Could part of the problem be an adverse reaction to running humidity that low during the day?

"Once the plant gets dry for too long, and that waxy cuticle layer is thin or totally gone, the leaf becomes nothing but a host for whatever pathogen happens to be floating by, photosynthesis stops, and the leaf becomes nothing more than a drain on the plant’s energy.

I would make the comparison to trying to grow a cannabis plant in too dry of an environment, as the same as trying to drive a car across a desert with just water and no antifreeze/coolant in the radiator, you may make it, but it's way more prone to overheat, and while you plant may make it through a dry environment, it's more than likely to have problems associated with lack of humidity."

https://growmag.com/todd-mccormick/

It looks like some of the leaf spots might be where the water was pulled from the the leaves by the osmotic pressure created by the high heat, low humidity environment and the constant air circulation. Leaves curl like this when they dry, right?

mr K help me here! it must be something I'm not seeing?

I don't believe it's temperature and/or humidity because from what he said they seemed in line

"Temps range from 73-79 during the day with 39-43% humidity and at night it's around 69 and 45% humidity"

Those are way better than some of my readings believe me LOL

I've never seen a plant do this that presented the slurry numbers that he's posting

he's going to grab a 2nd slurry test later from deep down, going to be interesting to see those results!

Edit: + 1 lower the fan speed a little but watch that temperatures don't rise

 

[Beachwalker]

Looks fungal, maybe transferred from the thrip bites.

OP if the next slurry test has numbers that are in line may have to start looking at something fungal or bacterial

 

[Kanzeon]

mr K help me here! it must be something I'm not seeing?

I don't believe it's temperature and/or humidity because from what he said they seemed in line

"Temps range from 73-79 during the day with 39-43% humidity and at night it's around 69 and 45% humidity"

Those are way better than some of my readings believe me LOL

I've never seen a plant do this that presented the slurry numbers that he's posting

he's going to grab a 2nd slurry test later from deep down, going to be interesting to see those results!

Edit: + 1 lower the fan speed a little but watch that temperatures don't rise

I could totally be wrong, I'm just going by Ye Olde VPD Chart of Googling.

If that's right, then the protective wax has been stripped from the leaf tips. Maybe exacerbated by the thrips and overfeeding?