🤷‍♀️ excess or deficiency nutrients or virus ? help me 🙏

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F.Dupp

F.Dupp

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i made all . but how it happened after veg stage ? in flowering all things became shitty ?! is it possible ?
Yes. It's possible that the toxicity had to build up before becoming all encompassing.

I wish I could find that old forum thread. It might have even been on the original overgrow forums before they got raided by the dea back in the day.

Show detailed pics of your setup and maybe I can spot something suspect. I have been building my own aeroponics systems for the last 20 years, and I think I've encountered every issue there is. Except yours.
 
Captspaulding

Captspaulding

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I’ve read through the whole thread before commenting. @WeeDoxic you said your light was at 100%, but how high above the tops is your light? Some of the higher leaf damage looks like light damage I’ve seen. Which sometimes results in Ca deficiency, which looks like some of your leaf damage. Foxtailing fits right in with this hypothesis, too. Excessive light stress.

Or it could be what everyone else said it is! LOL 🤷🏼‍♂️

Nah, probably root rot and other stuff. But do check your light height.
Root rot is a very real possibility here, if they never really dried out, in those conditions…….I’d crack some buckets and see if they are doing the nasty.
 
Deadstill

Deadstill

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i made all . but how it happened after veg stage ? in flowering all things became shitty ?! is it possible ?
@WeeDoxic did you see my reply at the bottom of Page 3? If not go check it out and let me know what's up with your water and roots

Let's get a look at those roots can you post a picture of them?
 
Mothman

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We have added weeks to our grow season at a low cost. Moved all the plants so they were close together. Took 1/2 pvc pipe and made hoop house with 6mill clear plastic over plants the plants 1 hoop house had 6 large plants under it the other two had 4 plants each. Then we took 1 1/2 inch pvc and built a big hoop house over all three of the smaller hoop houses covered with 6mill clear plastic. We put a small 1500 watt heater inbetween the two hoop house. Finished budding in mid November could have grown into December if we would have to. Did use a hand blower to remove snow 2 times less than 2 inches. Put it all up in the garage and used it 2 more years. Then the wife tossed in her 2 cents and we started growing outside a good month early using the hoop houses. Now I live in Virginia and we have a long grow season.
Interesting set up. So now do you leave them in the hoop houses through the summer? Or are they just to get you through the first month or two outdoors?
 
WeeDoxic

WeeDoxic

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Howdy, and if I haven't said it before, welcome to the Farm!

So first of all your tap water, where does it come from? Town water, well water? 300 ppm to start, doing hydro, is probably half of your problem. I would venture to guess you also have root issues. Are you able to check the roots? How do they look? Are they bright white and clean looking, or are they slimy and brownish? This looks to me like a case of root rot combined with or resulting in nutrient lockouts.

Let me know and we'll work from there! Don't give up, we're here to help 🤠
its pipe water . town water . 300 ppm
yep roots are light brown . i used H2O2 twice . and nothing changed
what can i do to save them ? system collapsed?
 
F.Dupp

F.Dupp

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I switched from Hydroguard to hypochlorous acid. It makes life much easier when running a sterile rez. It's also much cheaper if you use pool shock to make your own. And hypochlorous acid doesn't have an expiration date, unlike hydroguard.

For people who insist on using Hydroguard-
Southern Ag Garden Friendly Fungicide is the same shit, but more concentrated. And at a much better price.
 
Captspaulding

Captspaulding

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Hydroguard will even keep root rot at bay in hydro system without a water chiller , to a certain point. But it will handle a very high temperature and still keep roots just as white and pretty. It's really amazing.
its pipe water . town water . 300 ppm
yep roots are light brown . i used H2O2 twice . and nothing changed
what can i do to save them ? system collapsed?
How’s do the roots smell? Funky? Or ok?
 
WeeDoxic

WeeDoxic

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18
I switched from Hydroguard to hypochlorous acid. It makes life much easier when running a sterile rez. It's also much cheaper if you use pool shock to make your own. And hypochlorous acid doesn't have an expiration date, unlike hydroguard.

For people who insist on using Hydroguard-
Southern Ag Garden Friendly Fungicide is the same shit, but more concentrated. And at a much better price.
whats the right dosage ?
 
WeeDoxic

WeeDoxic

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18
Yes. It's possible that the toxicity had to build up before becoming all encompassing.

I wish I could find that old forum thread. It might have even been on the original overgrow forums before they got raided by the dea back in the day.

Show detailed pics of your setup and maybe I can spot something suspect. I have been building my own aeroponics systems for the last 20 years, and I think I've encountered every issue there is. Except yours.
before issue in veg stage :
and setup :
 
F.Dupp

F.Dupp

190
63
its pipe water . town water . 300 ppm
yep roots are light brown . i used H2O2 twice . and nothing changed
what can i do to save them ? system collapsed?
If you have the rot, remove the plants from the system and put them in a bucket containing a couple inches of clean water. Preferably chlorinated tap water. Let the plants sit with the roots in the clean water for a few hours while you tear apart the entire system and scrub it. Then run h2o2 through the system at high concentration for a couple of hours to sterilize it. Then rinse and return the plants to the system. Add hypochlorous acid every 3 days to maintain sterility. Then wait 6 months for those plants to return to health.

Or just cut everything down, sterilize your shit, and start over.

Next time maintain a sterile environment. And don't use h2o2. It's volatile AF and doesn't work for shit. Make your own hypochlorous acid for next to nothing. By a bag of pool shock. Make sure it contains 68% calcium hypochlorite. Mix 1.7g of pool shock per gallon of distilled or RO water. Add this mixture to your rez at the rate of 6ml per gallon. You will no longer have issues with root rot.
 
Last edited:
F.Dupp

F.Dupp

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63
And I have dealt with root rot many times. None of those times did my plants look anything like yours do. While rot might be an issue, there is definitely something else happening here.

You should scope your plants for russet/broad mites. Some piercing/sucking bugs actually inject toxic shit into your plants, causing them to get extremely fkd up.
 
Deadstill

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its pipe water . town water . 300 ppm
yep roots are light brown . i used H2O2 twice . and nothing changed
what can i do to save them ? system collapsed?

Well I can say you would benefit greatly from an RO system. I highly recommend this one for budget reasons and for small grows - https://www.amazon.com/3-Stage-Port..._5?keywords=geekpure+RO&qid=1687409269&sr=8-5

When doing Hydro it's always best to start out with clean RO water. My hydro systems are custom built NFT style setups. As some of you may or may not know, NFT is highly prone to light leaks and resulting in root rot.

First might want to make sure your whole hydro system is well sealed from light. You don't want any light getting into the reservoir or the root zone, this is what generally causes root rot to start.

Second, since I use NFT style, I generally run a sterile system. Hydroguard only works to a point. So I put bleach in my NFT reservoirs. Use Clorox disinfecting bleach (NOT the splash-less crap, make SURE it's "disinfecting" bleach whatever brand you buy). The stuff I use is 7.5% Sodium Hypochlorite.

With a heavy infestation of root rot probably start out with about 5ml of bleach per gallon of water. You can even go as high as 10ml.

If you can totally seal off the root zone from all light the bleach should do a pretty decent job of keeping the root rot under control.

At this point, as others have suggested, if it's really bad, you might want to consider starting over, but it can be saved if you start right now with all the steps I mentioned above. As I said, starting out with clean RO water first and foremost will help eliminate a LOT of problems.

If you go the bleach route, make sure to change your reservoir water out regularly, this will help accelerate recovery. Bleach evaporates from water over time. I've had severe cases of root rot (much worse than you have there, I'm sure) that I managed to clear up in a week or two. Just change your res. water roughly every 3 or 4 days. This will obviously use up more of your fertilizers having to change the res. water so frequently, but you'll just have to weigh that against whether you want to save the plants or just start over. All up to you.

Also, if you can, after (or during) you empty your reservoir to change the water, it will help tremendously to open up those buckets and, with your hands and fingers, gently rub the roots to try to get as much slime off of them as possible. Maybe use a sprayer or something to try to "pressure wash" the slimy crap off the roots. This will make a big difference, as well. Get the whole system as clean as possible. Scrub any crap off the sides of your res, clean out your hoses and buckets, etc.

It's not an easy fight, but I find in a lot of hydro systems it's a lot easier to just run a sterile system. Hydroguard has a shelf life and I've found, usually, when I buy it, it's already expired, unless you buy it from a store that gets fresh stock on a regular basis. But, I've had absolutely horrible experience using Hydroguard. It's a waste of money in my opinion.

Once you have your root rot totally cleaned up (or if starting over) you generally want to use about 3ml of bleach per gallon in your res. and you can add an additional 3ml per gallon once or twice a week for preventative measures.

I would say, if you can, try to see if any light is getting in at the root zone at all. Maybe you could empty out the buckets and put your phone inside recording a video, then seal it all up. Open it back up, grab the phone, and observe the video and see if you can see any light coming in. Get resourceful and try to figure it out.

Another tip is to make sure your res. water temperature isn't getting too warm or too cold. Generally you want to keep it between 65 and 75 degrees, certainly no more than 80 and no less than 60. Higher res. temps are a good breeding ground of root rot, as well.

There are water coolers available or hydroponics if you search around on Amazon or your local grow store might carry them, but they can be pricey, but also worth it if you have no other options.

I custom fabricated my own water cooling system. I used an old radiator I had (make sure it doesn't leak obviously and clean it out as best you can if it's used). I keep the radiator outside of my grow room with a small fan on it. It generally keeps my water around 68 degrees, but that all depends on the environment it's in, of course. This obviously isn't the best method, but if you're on a budget and you can pull it off, it does work.

One other tip is to make sure your res. is well aerated. Another tip if you're using an air pump is to move the air pump outside of your grow room (or tent or whatever you're growing in) and run the air lines into your reservoir that way. Or, keep the entire reservoir outside of the grow room,/tent/whatever, this may solve a lot of issues all together.

Sorry if this jumbled or hard to understand, I'm half awake at the moment so if you have any questions or need further explanation just hit me up and I'll be glad to elaborate and help as much as possible.

Let me know what ya want to do!

Good luck to you!
🤠
 
Harpua88

Harpua88

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I use canna 1050 ppm till I add pk booster then jump to 1250 for a few feedings I grow in soil bottom feed I would check pH also nutrients lock possible
Well hello sailor......!

Very nice. It's this kind of dialing in on flowering I'm hoping to achieve.....
 
Harpua88

Harpua88

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Wow, so much in this thread. This is like an advanced hydro class.

This might be why I use dirt, ;) but a lot of knowledge and good advice here for those who go the hydro route......root. ;)
 
Deadstill

Deadstill

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Wow, so much in this thread. This is like an advanced hydro class.

This might be why I use dirt, ;) but a lot of knowledge and good advice here for those who go the hydro route......root. ;)

Hydro is definitely not an easy method for beginners, that's for sure. It can be expensive, too. I started doing hydro very early on, as a side project when I was growing underground weed for some very bad people back in the late 90's early 00's. Sort of just for my own private stash. It was very much a trial and error, steep learning curve type of thing. It's amazing how far we've come in technology and research in the cannabis industry today.

Shit, I remember when we used to steal street lamps for our flowering lights. 🤣 Glad those days are behind us!
 
WeeDoxic

WeeDoxic

53
18
Well I can say you would benefit greatly from an RO system. I highly recommend this one for budget reasons and for small grows - https://www.amazon.com/3-Stage-Port..._5?keywords=geekpure+RO&qid=1687409269&sr=8-5

When doing Hydro it's always best to start out with clean RO water. My hydro systems are custom built NFT style setups. As some of you may or may not know, NFT is highly prone to light leaks and resulting in root rot.

First might want to make sure your whole hydro system is well sealed from light. You don't want any light getting into the reservoir or the root zone, this is what generally causes root rot to start.

Second, since I use NFT style, I generally run a sterile system. Hydroguard only works to a point. So I put bleach in my NFT reservoirs. Use Clorox disinfecting bleach (NOT the splash-less crap, make SURE it's "disinfecting" bleach whatever brand you buy). The stuff I use is 7.5% Sodium Hypochlorite.

With a heavy infestation of root rot probably start out with about 5ml of bleach per gallon of water. You can even go as high as 10ml.

If you can totally seal off the root zone from all light the bleach should do a pretty decent job of keeping the root rot under control.

At this point, as others have suggested, if it's really bad, you might want to consider starting over, but it can be saved if you start right now with all the steps I mentioned above. As I said, starting out with clean RO water first and foremost will help eliminate a LOT of problems.

If you go the bleach route, make sure to change your reservoir water out regularly, this will help accelerate recovery. Bleach evaporates from water over time. I've had severe cases of root rot (much worse than you have there, I'm sure) that I managed to clear up in a week or two. Just change your res. water roughly every 3 or 4 days. This will obviously use up more of your fertilizers having to change the res. water so frequently, but you'll just have to weigh that against whether you want to save the plants or just start over. All up to you.

Also, if you can, after (or during) you empty your reservoir to change the water, it will help tremendously to open up those buckets and, with your hands and fingers, gently rub the roots to try to get as much slime off of them as possible. Maybe use a sprayer or something to try to "pressure wash" the slimy crap off the roots. This will make a big difference, as well. Get the whole system as clean as possible. Scrub any crap off the sides of your res, clean out your hoses and buckets, etc.

It's not an easy fight, but I find in a lot of hydro systems it's a lot easier to just run a sterile system. Hydroguard has a shelf life and I've found, usually, when I buy it, it's already expired, unless you buy it from a store that gets fresh stock on a regular basis. But, I've had absolutely horrible experience using Hydroguard. It's a waste of money in my opinion.

Once you have your root rot totally cleaned up (or if starting over) you generally want to use about 3ml of bleach per gallon in your res. and you can add an additional 3ml per gallon once or twice a week for preventative measures.

I would say, if you can, try to see if any light is getting in at the root zone at all. Maybe you could empty out the buckets and put your phone inside recording a video, then seal it all up. Open it back up, grab the phone, and observe the video and see if you can see any light coming in. Get resourceful and try to figure it out.

Another tip is to make sure your res. water temperature isn't getting too warm or too cold. Generally you want to keep it between 65 and 75 degrees, certainly no more than 80 and no less than 60. Higher res. temps are a good breeding ground of root rot, as well.

There are water coolers available or hydroponics if you search around on Amazon or your local grow store might carry them, but they can be pricey, but also worth it if you have no other options.

I custom fabricated my own water cooling system. I used an old radiator I had (make sure it doesn't leak obviously and clean it out as best you can if it's used). I keep the radiator outside of my grow room with a small fan on it. It generally keeps my water around 68 degrees, but that all depends on the environment it's in, of course. This obviously isn't the best method, but if you're on a budget and you can pull it off, it does work.

One other tip is to make sure your res. is well aerated. Another tip if you're using an air pump is to move the air pump outside of your grow room (or tent or whatever you're growing in) and run the air lines into your reservoir that way. Or, keep the entire reservoir outside of the grow room,/tent/whatever, this may solve a lot of issues all together.

Sorry if this jumbled or hard to understand, I'm half awake at the moment so if you have any questions or need further explanation just hit me up and I'll be glad to elaborate and help as much as possible.

Let me know what ya want to do!

Good luck to you!
🤠
Tanx for this complete answer
i found it today and decide save my girls instead Restart
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