Gavita pro 600 / LEP 300 PLASMA test

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whazzup

whazzup

Hi Herb! Buzy as usual Sir, trying to get all those nice new products to the market. Thanks for sharing your experiences.

I don't think a lot of suppliers underhype their products, but when you sell to a professional market I assure you you will not get very far with trying to make things look better than they are, you will not survive. With the two cycles (well, 1,5 rounded to 2 for the less experienced growers) I also take into account the electricity costs but I do not take into account the better quality. It's just purely based on ppf.

People in this market sometimes make strange choices when it comes to investments ;)
 
whazzup

whazzup

Thanks for all the nice words guys. But really, as always your experiences are much more important than what I have to say about it. I also make mistakes or am proven wrong. I have said some pretty stupid things in the past when I read them back :D. So always be critical when you read "stuff on the net" (which includes me) and never stop thinking yourself and cross-checking things.

I do not do this as part of my job btw, my boss does not pay me for spending a few hours on the forums each day of the week unfortunately. Not that he objects of course.

I put my first seed in the ground in '83, and after a very long period of not growing at all I picked it up again about 8 years ago. Of course I literally ate overgrow.com. I thought it was great that people in this community share knowledge and insights, some at great risk too. I really got up to speed with modern growing techniques fast and it all made sense looking back at the mistakes I made in the past. I have been a professional (technical) trainer for many years and I just enjoy being able to help others get a better understanding. So look at it as a bit of giving back and sharing. I am in the unique position that I have access to really interesting information, and though some I can not share because they are a company secret I try to give back as much as possible. Do I have fun in what I do at work? You betcha!
 
nangonug

nangonug

Premium Member
Supporter
you will have only one problem, and that is the spread of the light in a square tent, as the plasma lights (point source) have a square light field. Two plasma's are ideal in a 1.50x3m tent for veg and mothers, for serious vegetative growth with plasma alone in a 3x3m you would have to invest in 4 for a complete plasma lit veg tent.

Again, I do not want to over-hype plasma, it is a great solution, but it comes at a cost. A combination of 4 1000W and 4 plasma for flowering would be a dream setup though.
Sorry I'm on the other side of the pond! That would me 1m x1m (3ft x3ft) times 2 trays one plasma each should be perfect yes?
 
whazzup

whazzup

hehe 3x3 for me is 3x3 meters, so my example was for a 3x3m tent (10x10')

Generally for keeping mother plants you can use a plasma lamp for an area of about 5x5'. If you really want to produce or for vegetative growth I would recommend a smaller area (more light), as small as 3x3' is perfect for one plasma. You will just have a hard time fitting the fixture I'm afraid if you have a small stand-alone tent like that.

Remember that when you switch to 12 hours from 18 hours you will reduce the dli (the amount of light you give a plant per day) by 30%! For the same photosynthesis in flowering this means that you need 30% more light during the 12 hours you light them in flowering. So during the 18 hours of veg a lower intensity than your flowering light will suffice.

old school in Holland is veg under 400W Mh and flower under 600W HPS, or a combination of MH and HPS.
 
chazbolin

chazbolin

just for the record guys, (and it is the last thing I'll say about this subject until there is some real news): Gavita is a Luxim Business partner. When there is something new available, we have it. When they announce something new we already know it. Last year there were rumors about a new module, and preliminary specs were released in a newsletter. Unfortunately this model is not even out of its prototype stage. Luxim is a venture capital backed company which has to produce and innovate. But they hurt themselves by bringing out this information as the new module, let alone a fixture for it, will not be available in a long time. Last year some people were suggesting that it would be on the market soon (it was not) or latest beginning of this year (it was not). Now these rumor surface again as there is a light show in May where Luxim will be. Please visit their booth and see a dummy of a new module which will be not even pre-production ready until end of the year, so do not expect a new fixture until somewhere next year. We are not in the business of spreading rumors or misinformation. You can not take decisions based on rumors. So, if people on the forums I manage insist to keep on undermining the information flow by spreading false rumors (or even say I am a misinformed liar) I will warn them not to do so any more. If they persist: I have better things to do than fight windmills 9and we have a lot of then in Holland :D).

For those who still want to wait for a new and bigger module: The current plasma fixture has a pay-back time (just based on the added light output and corresponding yield) of less than two cycles. I do not even take quality into this consideration. So you get a good ROI for this fixture. Also it remains to be seen if you can swap the 300W for the new module. You need to be able to spread the light over a surface, specifically when you combine it with HPS. That means that you would need to have a much wider reflector or hang it higher to get the same mix of HPS and plasma.

So my recommendation is to not wait and just experience the plasma for yourself. It is a no-brainer if you calculate the pay back time. For HPS fixtures the pay-back time is of course less than one cycle.

Then about the price (just to give you an idea of our strategy): Our competitors in the US, for example Chameleon, have a much higher MSRP ($ 1695) to be able to give the shops a bigger margin, and for that they give you a metal box with a fan in it. Our horticultural quality fixture (solid state fanless, custom design, Miro reflecotor, float glass wide spectrum filter, Wieland connector, inox parts) has an MSRP in the US of $ 1299. This has been the price since launch. We keep the price and margins low to enable people to actually be able to afford this lamp. It will not become cheaper this year. Recently Chameleon in the US announced their prices to drop, I think they have a special deal for 1395. This is not to talk bad about the competition, they do a good job promoting this new technology and investing in it, there is more than enough room in the market for more suppliers. It's just to put thing a bit more in perspective.

New technology is exciting, and even more so if it is affordable. As most of you will not be growing lettuce and tomatoes the break even point will be much faster than with any horticultural crop. You will get a better ROI with a HPS lamp, no doubt about it. LEP is still by far not as efficient as HPS in producing photons. It can not (contrary to what some of the competition tries to sell it for) replace a 1000W or even 600W HPS. It will replace a 400W MH if you just look at lumens. We have always been very open and precise about what you can and can not do with this lamp. Lighting is a science.

sorry if I am not always popping in when a question arises, fortunately there are many plasma users already who can answer most questions now :) (thanks Herb!)
LF 2012 Las Vegas BABY! I'll be there.
 
nangonug

nangonug

Premium Member
Supporter
hehe 3x3 for me is 3x3 meters, so my example was for a 3x3m tent (10x10')

Generally for keeping mother plants you can use a plasma lamp for an area of about 5x5'. If you really want to produce or for vegetative growth I would recommend a smaller area (more light), as small as 3x3' is perfect for one plasma. You will just have a hard time fitting the fixture I'm afraid if you have a small stand-alone tent like that.

Remember that when you switch to 12 hours from 18 hours you will reduce the dli (the amount of light you give a plant per day) by 30%! For the same photosynthesis in flowering this means that you need 30% more light during the 12 hours you light them in flowering. So during the 18 hours of veg a lower intensity than your flowering light will suffice.

old school in Holland is veg under 400W Mh and flower under 600W HPS, or a combination of MH and HPS.
No prob, I know these fixtures are heavy. My friend is running one now. I have rafters above my veg area so positioning them securely is just a mater of placing the bolt in the right spot. . I have 2 3x3 ( 1mx1m) trays sitting on a bench that currently have t5's over them. Thats 24 t'5 over a 3x8 area. If I could eliminate my t'5 and put 2 plasmas over the area I would be saving over 600 watts. Plus I would have a reduced heat load. Thats a win win in my book. Its just a long time for payback on investment at there current price. Do you see the prices staying level on these fixtures over the next 6 months or do you anticipate a reduction of cost any time soon?
 
T

theherbalizor

Premium Member
Supporter
Sorry for the lack of promised bud shots or smoke reports. I have been ill and busy.

But smoke wise it seams a little more potent and sticky to normal. But this was my first run with plasma so we shall see on the second run.

I figured ill put up some shots of what i have cooking.

I went down to 6 plants. Chemdog D, PsychoDiesel, Casy Jones, Giesel, Blueberry and TWOG.

All plants vegged for 4-5 weeks under one plasma for 3 weeks and 2 weeks of veg under 2 plasmas. Scroging all the way. I am flowering under the same configuration as the last 600w pro el, Plasma, 600w Pro EL.

I am now on Reverse Osmosis water, Aqua flakes A&B and humbolt Flavourful, Hydro Honey and HUMBOLT. Superior potash and Bud xl. All looks and smells great. Super sticky.

Anyway, day 47 update. 6 plants coco drippers.
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M

maxwell murder

Anyone interested in Gavitas 300 LEP wait until the new version is available STA 75). The latest and greatest Luxim puck should be shown at light fair 2012 in May on the 9th I believe. Look for production models to follow.

It has twice the output of the current 300w LEP with only an additional 150w. I can understand Gavita wanting to push the hell out of the current stock and supress all information regarding the latest version as Whazzup has done however he bans members in doing so.

Either way, if you wait you will get a better product for your money or a price reduction on the current model.
any word on these new leps?
 
ttystikk

ttystikk

Be careful, he is a sales person who will ban you on his mother forum if you speak against him.

Anyone interested in Gavitas 300 LEP wait until the new version is available STA 75). The latest and greatest Luxim puck should be shown at light fair 2012 in May on the 9th I believe. Look for production models to follow.

It has twice the output of the current 300w LEP with only an additional 150w. I can understand Gavita wanting to push the hell out of the current stock and supress all information regarding the latest version as Whazzup has done however he bans members in doing so.

Either way, if you wait you will get a better product for your money or a price reduction on the current model.
First, why are you so paranoid? As far as I can tell, he's never said a cross word to anyone, certainly not here- and yet the first thing out of oyur mouth is a bunch of shit? That undermines YOUR cred, not his.

Second, we are all well aware that in the modern world, nearly all prices drop and quantity/quality goes up over time, especially in electronics. You can get old waiting for a new and better product to come along for cheap, or you can make the calculation anywhere along that timeline that price has dropped and quality has increased ENOUGH for you to invest and start utilizing the tech.

Did I buy a flat panel TV when they were $20,ooo? No, but I damned sure did when they came down to $1k and this is different only in the regard that, unlike a new TV, this is an investment- it will pay for itself and in very short order. Unless, of course, you're all talk and no grow action...
 
U

ukbigbud

What do you expect the yield to be this time round????? 100 oz again out of a 1.5 x 1.5 tent????? Bull
 
T

theherbalizor

Premium Member
Supporter
Fire away sdg.

Ukbigbud - 100 oz would be lovely but that's near 30 more than last time.

I will prob do a little less than last time as I have ran two low yielders and no top shooter this run.
 
El Cerebro

El Cerebro

100 oz would be lovely but that's near 30 more than last time.
Say what? Out of that tent! Lost track of this and need to go back and read from the beginning. Impressive work, and def getting stoked on gavita with what's being shown. Nice to have whazzup contributing, read lots of your posts and really appreciate your perspective.
 
sdgrower

sdgrower

Thanks Herb!
Whazzup,

I saw some gavita product info regarding the aysymetric reflector adjustment ( the deep wide deep settings) using the gavita triplestar 1000 reflectors . What kind of area does that cover?
Thanks
 
ttystikk

ttystikk

Thanks Herb!
Whazzup,

I saw some gavita product info regarding the aysymetric reflector adjustment ( the deep wide deep settings) using the gavita triplestar 1000 reflectors . What kind of area does that cover?
Thanks
Just looked them up- they don't seem too far out of the mainstream for reflectors and their adjustability might come in handy. Area covered depends on the usual suspects; wattage bulb installed, height above the canopy, density of lights above the canopy.
 
sdgrower

sdgrower

Whazzup,

I was actually wondering if you had recommended spacing measurements for 3 hoods in the asymetric reflector adjustment. All would be 1000 watt bulbs.
Thanks
 
whazzup

whazzup

there is no 1000W TripleStar yet, only a 600W one. The spread in the 3 positions is indicated on the iso diagrams. It depends on how much light you want on your crop of course but basically hang them parallel, enter about 80-120cm apart, depending on distance and required light levels (40-45-50 degrees).

Careful: the DEEP reflector is the opposite reflector, so with 3 reflectors:

WD WW DW


This btw is on the website and in the documentation that can be downloaden
 
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