Grove Bags Yes? No? Why?

[Moe.Red]

I gave you an answer, a little grassy smell is normal in the early stages of cure as chlorophyll breaks down... Just let them cure then judge. I don't think anyone is being "clique-y" just because we all have similar responses... usually one would take that to mean that's probably the true answer?

Yes ma’am you did. I thought that was absolutely correct and good advice.

There is no click here other than the overall sense that some growers have proven they are accomplished and have something to offer. If listening to experience is clicky count me in.

 

[Moe.Red]

Ok folks . Let's just sit back and burn a fatty. Relax it's all good. Lessoned learned.

Great plan.

 

[RootsRuler]

I hope it works. I just find this stuff fun from an engineering standpoint. I’m not sure there is any such thing as the best cure. Doesn’t keep me from looking for one tho.

I can see how it would work. Same principal as ski clothing. Back in the day you had to suffer freezing on the ride up and sweating your ass off at the bottom of the hill.

3M developed a fabric that can wick away the perspiration but not let wind in. I was VERY skeptical until I bought a jacket and pants. WOW! What a difference!

This was at least a decade ago so I can see how tech like that could have developed. I guess it's hard to pry me out of my old school ways!!!

 

[Dothraki]

I gave you an answer, a little grassy smell is normal in the early stages of cure as chlorophyll breaks down... Just let them cure then judge. I don't think anyone is being "clique-y" just because we all have similar responses... usually one would take that to mean that's probably the true answer?

I appreciate it… but also, I was looking for a larger number of answers to pool my info from, and try to form an idea of everything that’s really going on with the microbes and whole process. Different environments, practices and results etc. It’s a tough time to learn the science because everyone has methods that work for them (at least as far as they are concerned) but research and papers on these details are few and far between and many are not peer reviewed, just what we call “bro science”.

LOL! Do you like 90's movies? Ever seen one called "Clueless"?

Haha, yeah if I was a hot blonde in a miniskirt life would be so much easier. I’m more in the Mrs. Doubtfire camp.

 

[TSD]

I appreciate it… but also, I was looking for a larger number of answers to pool my info from, and try to form an idea of everything that’s really going on with the microbes and whole process. Different environments, practices and results etc. It’s a tough time to learn the science because everyone has methods that work for them (at least as far as they are concerned) but research and papers on these details are few and far between and many are not peer reviewed, just what we call “bro science”.




Haha, yeah if I was a hot blonde in a miniskirt life would be so much easier. I’m more in the Mrs. Doubtfire camp.

Well, if you're concerned it's due to the bags, put some in jars and see if there's a difference. Not sure if you'll get a ton more answers, grove bags are a relatively new deal and not everyone uses them. It's best to test different ways for yourself and find your preferred method for your specific situation. Just remember curing in general is a slow process, I'm always amazed how much the smell improves over the course of a month or so, whether it's bags or jars. I used jars for many years, still use them for head smoke, they are the standard for curing, groves just make it easier and more fool proof, especially if you have a ton of weed. I probably would have never discovered them had I not accidentally grown 10 pounds last year.

 

[Moe.Red]

Well, if you're concerned it's due to the bags, put some in jars and see if there's a difference. Not sure if you'll get a ton more answers, grove bags are a relatively new deal and not everyone uses them. It's best to test different ways for yourself and find your preferred method for your specific situation. Just remember curing in general is a slow process, I'm always amazed how much the smell improves over the course of a month or so, whether it's bags or jars. I used jars for many years, still use them for head smoke, they are the standard for curing, groves just make it easier and more fool proof, especially if you have a ton of weed. I probably would have never discovered them had I not accidentally grown 10 pounds last year.

Good points.

I’ll just say that hay smell has nothing to do with the bags. Search the term and it is quite common and normal. It’s one reason why we cure. Genetics and grower influence leading up to harvest as well as methods (how much leaf material you leave when trimming) all contribute.

It’s not a cannabis thing either. It’s a plant thing.

 

[Dothraki]

I probably would have never discovered them had I not accidentally grown 10 pounds last year.

omg! I think trimming 1 lb is my limit. Lots of hash I’d have lol.

Good points.

I’ll just say that hay smell has nothing to do with the bags. Search the term and it is quite common and normal. It’s one reason why we cure. Genetics and grower influence leading up to harvest as well as methods (how much leaf material you leave when trimming) all contribute.

It’s not a cannabis thing either. It’s a plant thing.

Yeah I just figured Grove Bags (since they exchange gasses so slow) might lock that bad flavor in. Both the good and bad.

 

[RootsRuler]

Haha, yeah if I was a hot blonde in a miniskirt life would be so much easier. I’m more in the Mrs. Doubtfire camp.

Cross dresser.....Got it!!!

 

[Dothraki]

Cross dresser.....Got it!!!

Be careful, I’ve been known to be involved in run by fruitings.

 

[TSD]

omg! I think trimming 1 lb is my limit. Lots of hash I’d have lol.

Yeah it was kind of a nightmare lol... I just got dry sift screens cause I still have a bunch from last year.

 

[Moe.Red]

Yeah I just figured Grove Bags (since they exchange gasses so slow) might lock that bad flavor in. Both the good and bad.

I... don't... think that is how it works.

I cure in glass - no gas exchange - and I'm not locking in any bad smells. Lemme find a pic...

Start with a proper dry

Then cure in these

Amazon.com

I can get you better pics later.

The vast majority of any hay smell is removed during the first week in the drying stage. If I have an especially wet grass smelling pheno, I can throw it in the freeze drier and the smell is completely removed overnight.

that's the freeze drier that got caught in the pic by accident behind the light bars.

What I am trying to explain to you is that you may have created some of your own issue with the way you treated the plant before harvest, how you harvest, and then how you dried and for sure how you are curing.

I can take a hay smelling plant and turn it into a "cured" good smelling plant overnight by using vacuum and freezing to remove all the water, and the chlorophyll comes out in the water.

After the run is done, you have to defrost and drain the freeze drier. That water that comes out smells really bad like a mixture of hay and I dunno, medicine? Guano? Just don't drink it.

If you don't have a freeze drier, what you do to dry and harvest will impact your sniffer.

I'm not sure what else to say here, except leave the damn bags closed and let them do what they were intended to do. Short of that - you get what you get.

You need the natural process of breakdown of chlorophyll and other non-beneficial compounds to occur, and your job is to encourage that. The way you are going about this is not encouraging the best product. This is not about groove bags at this point, it is about understanding what is happening in a cure.

Oh, and I don't burp my glass either. If you have to burp, you didn't dry properly / completely or did it too fast and there is uneven water amounts in the buds.

I've got pics, data, and video of this whole process somewhere, I'll dig it up if anyone wants to see it.

 

[Moe.Red]

Yeah it was kind of a nightmare lol... I just got dry sift screens cause I still have a bunch from last year.

I saw your screen output, very impressive. I've never done that myself, but I may give it a go. Normally when I get too much I just process it all down to concentrate and don't bother even trimming it. Screening seems like a viable option too.

 

[Moe.Red]

Oh, one other point. I measure things like cannabinoids at home. I can measure the impacts of this process over that process in real time.

My current process of dry --> cure in glass does not halt degradation over time. THC becomes CBN, even in complete dark at 60's temps untouched for months.

Freeze dried stuff that is vacuum sealed in mylar, O2 absorber in the mylar, then put in the deep freeze is the only way I have found to arrest breakdown of weed in storage. I have 3 year old weed right now that is very close to the day I put it in there. If groove bags can do that, I don't understand how. But I can see how they would help.

 

[TSD]

A

I have 3 year old weed right now that is very close to the day I put it in there. If groove bags can do that, I don't understand how. But I can see how they would help.

That's impressive! I've never tried to freeze weed, but I also don't have a mad scientist lab lol. Last year was the first year I've had such an abundance to where I still had a bunch at next harvest... and also the first year I've used the bags, so I can't compare to year old jarred stuff... It definitely still degrades, but I also didn't heat seal. It stays in an unheated room in a big cooler and it still smells good, but it's definitely not like it was fresh. I can't imagine it lasting years on end. I'm still pro grove bags though because they really do make life easier.

 

[Moe.Red]

I can't seem to shut up, but I thought of one other point. Drying =/= curing. They are 2 completely different processes that get lumped together, and one could be forgiven to assume that the cure process will complete a shoddy dry job.

If you look at it like that, you will make inferior product. At least flower.

Drying is getting the amount of water in the entire plant to exactly where you want it. If you have a 100g bud, 10, 11, 12 g of it will be water. The actual number is grower preference.

Curing is not removing any more water. Curing is letting the sugars, chlorophyll, enzymes, and so many more molecules change gradually over time to a less complex molecule that is more pleasing to the user. Proportions change. Some terps offgas. Water is shifted within the buds to be completely uniform thru all the plant matter and surrounding air. Every time you open to the environment, that process has to start over again. That includes burping.

Burping is avoided by only having the final water weight you desire put into the jar in the first place. That is a function of the dry process. Or you can use active means to regulate like boveda, but if done correctly those are unneeded.

Curing and drying are doing 2 different things and should be treated as such.

 

[Moe.Red]

A
That's impressive! I've never tried to freeze weed, but I also don't have a mad scientist lab lol. Last year was the first year I've had such an abundance to where I still had a bunch at next harvest... and also the first year I've used the bags, so I can't compare to year old jarred stuff... It definitely still degrades, but I also didn't heat seal. It stays in an unheated room in a big cooler and it still smells good, but it's definitely not like it was fresh. I can't imagine it lasting years on end. I'm still pro grove bags though because they really do make life easier.

I'm with you. Cheaper than glass too. From what I can see, they make a lot of sense for the majority of growers who want to use flower. I just didn't like the part where they supposedly prevent weed from aging. I'm from Missouri, you gotta show me lol.

 

[TSD]

I'm with you. Cheaper than glass too. From what I can see, they make a lot of sense for the majority of growers who want to use flower. I just didn't like the part where they supposedly prevent weed from aging. I'm from Missouri, you gotta show me lol.

Yeah I wouldn't say prevent cause, well, science... definitely slow down significantly of you use them 100% as intended and store them in a climate controlled space. I just read an article about cryogenics (random I know) where they thawed some of the frozen bodies of folks who's families had stopped paying for the cryo services, and the results were pretty much catastrophic, like every part of the bodies was just destroyed... my point being, even the greatest technology can't stop natural biological processes.

 

[Moe.Red]

Yeah I wouldn't say prevent cause, well, science... definitely slow down significantly of you use them 100% as intended and store them in a climate controlled space. I just read an article about cryogenics (random I know) where they thawed some of the frozen bodies of folks who's families had stopped paying for the cryo services, and the results were pretty much catastrophic, like every part of the bodies was just destroyed... my point being, even the greatest technology can't stop natural biological processes.

I don’t know, seems like they can make you younger with plastic surgery these days.

Just look how much better she is now!

 

[Moshmen]

I... don't... think that is how it works.

I cure in glass - no gas exchange - and I'm not locking in any bad smells. Lemme find a pic...

Start with a proper dry

View attachment 1313732

Then cure in these

Amazon.com

I can get you better pics later.

The vast majority of any hay smell is removed during the first week in the drying stage. If I have an especially wet grass smelling pheno, I can throw it in the freeze drier and the smell is completely removed overnight.

View attachment 1313733

that's the freeze drier that got caught in the pic by accident behind the light bars.

What I am trying to explain to you is that you may have created some of your own issue with the way you treated the plant before harvest, how you harvest, and then how you dried and for sure how you are curing.

I can take a hay smelling plant and turn it into a "cured" good smelling plant overnight by using vacuum and freezing to remove all the water, and the chlorophyll comes out in the water.

After the run is done, you have to defrost and drain the freeze drier. That water that comes out smells really bad like a mixture of hay and I dunno, medicine? Guano? Just don't drink it.

If you don't have a freeze drier, what you do to dry and harvest will impact your sniffer.

I'm not sure what else to say here, except leave the damn bags closed and let them do what they were intended to do. Short of that - you get what you get.

You need the natural process of breakdown of chlorophyll and other non-beneficial compounds to occur, and your job is to encourage that. The way you are going about this is not encouraging the best product. This is not about groove bags at this point, it is about understanding what is happening in a cure.

Oh, and I don't burp my glass either. If you have to burp, you didn't dry properly / completely or did it too fast and there is uneven water amounts in the buds.

I've got pics, data, and video of this whole process somewhere, I'll dig it up if anyone wants to see it.

I rarely burp either , mostly to ck be feel and smell no hygrometer in container either - figured I was the only one

 

[Dothraki]

I can't seem to shut up, but I thought of one other point. Drying =/= curing. They are 2 completely different processes that get lumped together, and one could be forgiven to assume that the cure process will complete a shoddy dry job.

If you look at it like that, you will make inferior product. At least flower.

Drying is getting the amount of water in the entire plant to exactly where you want it. If you have a 100g bud, 10, 11, 12 g of it will be water. The actual number is grower preference.

Curing is not removing any more water. Curing is letting the sugars, chlorophyll, enzymes, and so many more molecules change gradually over time to a less complex molecule that is more pleasing to the user. Proportions change. Some terps offgas. Water is shifted within the buds to be completely uniform thru all the plant matter and surrounding air. Every time you open to the environment, that process has to start over again. That includes burping.

Burping is avoided by only having the final water weight you desire put into the jar in the first place. That is a function of the dry process. Or you can use active means to regulate like boveda, but if done correctly those are unneeded.

Curing and drying are doing 2 different things and should be treated as such.

I actually just recently started looking at these differently. Using jars I would naturally get to finish off the dry through burping (especially in my dry environment) but with grove bags they will stay what they are, this is why I was burping the bags, to get them drier and help get the abundance of gas out. They do still burn real nice and stay lit…but might not be dry enough to get smooth and tasty like they were before they went in the bags (before they redistributed the moisture). After 3 days in the bag the stems wouldn’t snap anymore. But it does burn and stay lit. I have 2 bags I’m burping regularly, 2 bags I only ”burped” a couple times and the rest I left sealed and heat sealed. Sealed bags are reading 58-60 RH inside.

What I initially thought was strange was how flavorful and smooth they were before bagging. They were the most flavorful buds I’ve had in a long long time (both fantastic genetics). Nobody ever really talks about flavors and smells right off the dry (was 14-16 days, 64/60RH) but maybe that’s normal.