tobh goes swimming Dutch style

[Lynch_Ironside]

Good lookin. I've started taking stuff off every few days anyways, just to keep the bush under the skirt managed well, so looks like I'm on track. Appreciate you bro.

Looking great my man! I'm digging the Dutch bucket system! Cant wait to see how these ladies turn out!

 

[tobh]

Looking great my man! I'm digging the Dutch bucket system! Cant wait to see how these ladies turn out!

appreciate the kind words!

wish i could take credit for the design, but the commercial tomato and cucumber farmers take the cake on that one. brilliant design, easy to implement, even easier to run and maintain. couldn't be happier with it, aside from my implementation of it.

A handful of details about the overall setup can be improved on then it'd be perfect imo.

 

[Lynch_Ironside]

No problem! Eh prototypes are always lacking something have too much of something or just need a tweak or two... I think you're certainly moving in the right direction and judging by how happy your plants look I'd say they agree
I had an idea on your height complication, dont know if it's cost prohibitive but a res with a larger foot print say the entirety of your tent a 4'x4'x6" or something close to that would hold around 60 gallons and would be a third of the height you're currently taking up. You could then simply set the buckets on top while still being able to take advantage of gravity to drain.
They make totes designed to fit under beds and what not. I have a couple they are 36x24x6 approximately a 22 gallon capacity on those. Idk, just a thought

 

[tobh]

No problem! Eh prototypes are always lacking something have too much of something or just need a tweak or two... I think you're certainly moving in the right direction and judging by how happy your plants look I'd say they agree
I had an idea on your height complication, dont know if it's cost prohibitive but a res with a larger foot print say the entirety of your tent a 4'x4'x6" or something close to that would hold around 60 gallons and would be a third of the height you're currently taking up. You could then simply set the buckets on top while still being able to take advantage of gravity to drain.
They make totes designed to fit under beds and what not. I have a couple they are 36x24x6 approximately a 22 gallon capacity on those. Idk, just a thought

It certainly is a good thought, and I may do that if I don't get the next system built in time for the next run.

Ideally I'd like the res completely outside of the tent, but there are space constraints associated with that, plus the complication of not wanting to cut another hole in the tent for plumbing. Only the second run in this tent, I'd hate to damage it like that yet. With the current configuration, two sides of the tent are completely inaccessible, a third side has highly restricted access, so it leaves only one access point that's of any real use.

However this thought does have me thinking. I appreciate the input for sure!

 

[tobh]

Overnight, ppm stayed at 744, little bit of jumping to 755, but pretty stable. pH increased from 5.5 to 6.5, and water looks to have dropped a couple of gallons. Think feed is on point now, just have to watch consumption to confirm I've found the sweet spot for this stage.

Screen is about 1/2 full, so maybe another couple weeks unless the growth rates shoot up with me getting the feed dialed in and the schedule continuing to do its positive work.

Continuing to keep an eye on things, this is the first week I haven't done a change out so we'll see how the girls like it. It's finally looking stable enough, so my thoughts are why mess with something that's working.

 

[Aqua Man]

Ph swing may be a bit high. May wanna look at buffering to help stabilize it but if the plants look great then they looks great.

 

[beluga]

Neat setup..
Poppin' a squat on this

 

[tobh]

Ph swing may be a bit high. May wanna look at buffering to help stabilize it but if the plants look great then they looks great.

So a quick search is only returning that which I already use for buffering, GH pH down. What are some options for other, more stable buffering agents?

I wonder if there's some relation to the combination of rockwool and hydroton that could be influencing the swing? Or maybe some interaction between silica, Front Row AG, hygrozyme, and hydroguard at this point? Perhaps even an excess of one of the compounds?

Front Row AG has buffering agents, but they don't seem to really compete with my dosing of silica. I run ~15ml protekt to 9 gallons of solution. Per the label, they recommend 1/2-1tsp per gallon, so 5-10ml per gallon, which I run right up the middle.

Do you think that's a contributing factor to the rapid swing? A full ten point increase in pH over a period of 24 hours seems quite drastic.

 

[Aqua Man]

So a quick search is only returning that which I already use for buffering, GH pH down. What are some options for other, more stable buffering agents?

I wonder if there's some relation to the combination of rockwool and hydroton that could be influencing the swing? Or maybe some interaction between silica, Front Row AG, hygrozyme, and hydroguard at this point? Perhaps even an excess of one of the compounds?

Front Row AG has buffering agents, but they don't seem to really compete with my dosing of silica. I run ~15ml protekt to 9 gallons of solution. Per the label, they recommend 1/2-1tsp per gallon, so 5-10ml per gallon, which I run right up the middle.

Do you think that's a contributing factor to the rapid swing? A full ten point increase in pH over a period of 24 hours seems quite drastic.

Driving around so ill toss this up and hit ya up once I get home. I like potassium silicate.

Marijuana pH Levels for Growing Weed: A Basic Explanation

In this article, we discuss proper pH levels for your weed plants; alkalinity, soil pH, tap water, and the effects of nutrients on pH when growing marijuana

www.thcfarmer.com

 

[Akabudz]

@Aqua Man hey mate, are you familiar with plant magic bio silicon?

Never used it but may use this grow.

 

[Aqua Man]

@Aqua Man hey mate, are you familiar with plant magic bio silicon?

Never used it but may use this grow.

Looks like a decent product. Silicone dioxide is what plants take up. Potassium silicate is also a good buffer for ph specifically in RO to add back some alkalinity. This will raise the ph and you need more acid to bring it down creating a more stable ph. Of using hard water though I would look for silicone dioxide as a silica supplement. Like I say driving so I have to look later on what specifically your needs are.

 

[Aqua Man]

@Aqua Man hey mate, are you familiar with plant magic bio silicon?

Never used it but may use this grow.

Also silica needs to be added to a nutrient solution in a very specific way to prevent it from precipitating out or causing other nutrientsto precipitateout. Its always mixed first and given 10-30min of mixing time before PHing it down to 6.5 before adding anything else. If you test the ph of your water after adding silica to it will almost always be over a PH of 9.... so we need to add it and let it mix well for 10-30min then ph down to 6.5 before adding the rest. If you try adding it last you will see exactly what I mean while having the classic "O fuck" look on your face. For shots and giggles try a 1 gal for yourself. Its always nice to actually experience something to know first hand.

 

[Aqua Man]

@Aqua Man hey mate, are you familiar with plant magic bio silicon?

Never used it but may use this grow.

Now as I was saying before if you want to add silica to your feed without causing big increases to the ph or buffering capacity you want to use flowable silica as its PH neutral but if you want to use silica as a buffer for ph then I suggest potassium silicate as it will aid in creating a buffer and plants like both the potassium and silica. We do need to be mindful of how much we are changing our nutrient ratios with the potassium though.

 

[tobh]

Also silica needs to be added to a nutrient solution in a very specific way to prevent it from precipitating out or causing other nutrientsto precipitateout. Its always mixed first and given 10-30min of mixing time before PHing it down to 6.5 before adding anything else. If you test the ph of your water after adding silica to it will almost always be over a PH of 9.... so we need to add it and let it mix well for 10-30min then ph down to 6.5 before adding the rest. If you try adding it last you will see exactly what I mean while having the classic "O fuck" look on your face. For shots and giggles try a 1 gal for yourself. Its always nice to actually experience something to know first hand.

This is probably the step that is causing my wild swings. I'd expect the effect to taper down after a week, but by not pHing before adding in the rest of the nutrients, is there potential for the buffering of the nutrients to be ineffective? Or, further, pHing after everything is added instead requiring excess pH down, and still not getting fully advantage of whatever buffering may be available?

 

[Aqua Man]

This is probably the step that is causing my wild swings. I'd expect the effect to taper down after a week, but by not pHing before adding in the rest of the nutrients, is there potential for the buffering of the nutrients to be ineffective? Or, further, pHing after everything is added instead requiring excess pH down, and still not getting fully advantage of whatever buffering may be available?

If ya give me a list of your stuff and how ya mixing i can peek for any issue I may notice

 

[Aqua Man]

This is probably the step that is causing my wild swings. I'd expect the effect to taper down after a week, but by not pHing before adding in the rest of the nutrients, is there potential for the buffering of the nutrients to be ineffective? Or, further, pHing after everything is added instead requiring excess pH down, and still not getting fully advantage of whatever buffering may be available?

Yeah if you are getting precipitate then the nutrients affected... will not be available as they will fall out of the solution. You will see them likely at the bottom of the res.

 

[tobh]

If ya give me a list of your stuff and how ya mixing i can peek for any issue I may notice

Listed in order of application with amounts, assume this is mixing of a fresh res:

Tap water: 9 gallons, ~160ppm
DynaGro Pro-Tekt: 15ml
[Allow to mix for 10min via venturi pump]
Front Row AG, part A: 27g
[Allow to mix for 5min via venturi pump]
Front Row AG, part B: 25g
[Allow to mix for 5min via venturi pump]
Hygrozyme: 3oz
[Allow to mix for 5min via venturi pump]
pH down: 40ml
[Allow to mix for 10min via venturi pump]
Hydroguard: 18ml

This results in a final mixed solution of 750ppm, pH 5.5

 

[tobh]

Yeah if you are getting precipitate then the nutrients affected... will not be available as they will fall out of the solution. You will see them likely at the bottom of the res.

That may explain the sand like substance... it's almost like a dusting at the bottom of the res. That could also explain some of the other symptoms that have me mildly concerned despite the plants looking really good.

Odd discoloration (mild yellow spotting) on bigger fan leaves, but not significant enough to be visible in the pictures without zooming in significantly.

 

[Aqua Man]

That may explain the sand like substance... it's almost like a dusting at the bottom of the res. That could also explain some of the other symptoms that have me mildly concerned despite the plants looking really good.

Odd discoloration (mild yellow spotting) on bigger fan leaves, but not significant enough to be visible in the pictures without zooming in significantly.

Could be or maybe just some of the residue from chelates.

 

[tobh]

So given this additional info, it's got me thinking. I'm going to do a change out once I finish up work for the day. They've drank enough to warrant a top off now, and pH has crawled up five points overnight, EC staying the same. Will modify my process slightly. Instead of what I listed above, I plan on doing:

Tap, 9 gallons
Protekt, 45ml (last listing was a typo, apply at 5ml/gal)
[Allow to mix for 30min via venturi pump]
pH down to 6.5
[Allow to mix for 10min via venturi pump]
Front Row AG, part A: 27g
[Allow to mix for 10min via venturi pump]
Front Row AG, part B: 25g
[Allow to mix for 10min via venturi pump]
Hygrozyme: 3oz
[Allow to mix for 10min via venturi pump]
pH down to 5.5
[Wait 30 min, adjust pH further if needed]
Hydroguard: 18ml

While this is going to extend the change out process significantly in terms of time, I'm curious to see if it'll lead to a more stable pH. Can't hurt to give it a shot.